It’s not just you — no one is posting on social media anymore::Social media is on the decline. Instagram is all ads. No one’s posting on BeReal. TikTok is for influencers. The new place for sharing: group chats.
“no one is posting” posted by a bot and commented by AutoTL;DR bot !
dead internet, here we go!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pyMNIFZTQkg
in the end it will just be bots talking to bots all the way down
Exactly the point.
My big take away is that social media as we know it is likely generational. Like real time broadcast TV, it may just not be a thing at all in the future, at least not with the centrality we’ve become accustomed to.
Polls run here and especially on masto bare this out. Mastodon, for instance, leans x-gen/boomer with some millennial in its demographic. It’s hardly a young persons thing. Once you realise so much of the praise and enjoyment of the Fedi is that it reminds people of the older days of the internet, the generational picture becomes pretty clear. 15 year olds today were born after Twitter, Facebook and YouTube. Forums, Usenet, old Twitter are probably like black and white tv to them.
At the moment, I think it’s a major flaw of the Fedi, that it’s fundamentally backwards looking, trying to preserve older big-social designs rather than doing something more diverse or at least different.
An obvious example being private or closed spaces like group chats and the like including public versions if desired. This seems to be a growing form of online interaction, that is in a way more humane or eusocial. But apart from matrix, which sits separately, the Fedi is still stuck redoing Twitter and Reddit.
There’s only so many ways you can arrange a group of people, what they post and their audience. The fediverse is exploring most variations right now and it came up with things like decentralization and activity pub which are unlike any of the big platforms of yore.
It resembles the internet of the 90s only superficially. The underlying infrastructure and technology is completely different today. Most of the lean towards the 90s is caused by taking inspiration from the way they dealt with similar threats.
The fediverse is exploring most variations right now
Where are:
- private spaces
- messaging
- chat rooms
- my-space style personalised pages
- Fusions of any of the variations you’re thinking of?
- Microblogging + Reddit
- Blogging + reddit
- Youtube + others
- Any and all
- Social RSS feeds like Google Reader
- Wikis
- Market places
- Subscription based content platforms for any format (eg blogs like substack or videos like nebula)
- Heavily privacy and safety focused platforms (with, eg, abilities to control who can ever respond or see your content)
- Video shorts (which I personally hate, but there’s probably something of value there)
- Computationally rich posts/pages … that is, content that is not merely static text of an embedded video but contains interactive components with highly customisable graphics.
Without wanting to be aggressive or critical of you here … there’s a good chance you, like many of us, are stuck thinking the internet can only be so many things because that’s all we’ve been given for a while (like a long time … like Twitter and Youtube have been around for longer than half the age of the internet, like we’ve arguable had real stagnation that might look like the age of Dinosaurs from the future looking back).
I am also going to say that nostr has all these things in some alpha form or another. However, it is very much a mess right now and it is harder IMHO to connect with others or curate my feed with stuff I like.
The advantage of small groups and fedi is starting with a small network and growing it slowly, this is more rewarding than starting with the whole world and trying to pull back.
Nostr might have all the features but its a mess right now
Fusions of any of the variations you’re thinking of?
Have a look at https://fedidb.org/software, chances are something has popped up there.
my-space style personalised pages
Now that’s a blast from the past if I ever heard one. Do people really don’t understand why MySpace died? The notion of “personalized pages” went out of style several technological and social generations ago. They’re not coming back, and not because it can’t be done, because it’s an antiquated idea in almost every way.
there’s a good chance you, like many of us, are stuck thinking the internet can only be so many things because that’s all we’ve been given for a while
Given the above it’s ironic that you perceive me as stuck in my ways. 🙂
Everything you listed can be done nowadays and there’s software for it out there, way too much to list here. Thinking in terms of centralized and/or proprietary platforms is the old way. The new way involves offering services based on open source software, using portable infrastructure solutions, and making a privacy pledge to the users.
Everything you listed can be done either by setting it up yourself or by finding a service that offers it. There’s a billion options.
I’m sorry, but I think you’re being too aggressive here and dismissive about how much is not easily doable on the fediverse. We’re not living in some open source utopia where there’s an abundance of awesome software waiting to be used.
A few quick thoughts.
- I’m familiar with fedidb. Anything that matches my list is likely to be small and niche. If I’ve missed anything, let me know … it was the point of my response to highlight that all of these variations you claim exist are not so easily identifiable if they exist.
- Plenty of people (and businesses and professionals!) still have their own web pages of some sort or another. Things don’t have to look like MySpace for that to be a thing. It’s a generic service not at all bound to myspace’s particulars and easily coupled with other platform features (see eg firefish)
- I wasn’t thinking in terms of centralised platforms, my critique is in many ways the Fedi is.
Try Nostr, it is all the Fediverse wants to be but better
came up with things like decentralization and activity pub which are unlike any of the big platforms of yore.
I personally think activity pub is overrated. Not that it’s bad or anything. But many think of it, IMO, as the beginning and end of a new form of social media and people taking back the internet. In reality, I think it’s literally just a protocol and so much more than people recognise depends on what people build on top of it. So far, for example, the limited interoperability between lemmy/kbin and the microblogs/mastodon, which is not a simple bug fix away, at all, is a major friction between these two platforms that essentially forces them to be separate spaces/platforms. This is so despite both using ActivityPub and actually federating with each rather well. Because, it’s not (just) about the protocol, it’s about platform designs and structures … IE the software … and the protocol can only do or guarantee very little on that front.
From what I’ve gathered, the diaspora people didn’t adopt activitypub in large reason because of this, and I think they’ve always had a point. The pain some users have gone through trying to work out how to use lemmy and mastodon together, having been promised that ActivityPub is a whole new thing that creates a deep and wide fediverse, has been awful to see.
My big take away is that social media as we know it is likely generational
I don’t think that’s the right takeaway. The demographics of certain platforms may be skewed, but people who for example were active on Facebook 10 years ago still exist, they’re just posting a lot less.
I think engagement is down across the board because of various reasons: the continuing crappification of the various platforms, people are starting to realize the risks of oversharing and public sharing, people are getting turned off about loud toxic discussion, people are becoming aware that their data is being mined by faceless corporations who don’t have their best interest in mind, in short all the negatives of these platforms have become more obvious to the average user.
but people who for example were active on Facebook 10 years ago still exist,
What happens when they die?
Posting mostly drops to zero. Sometimes a family member will post on their account.
Death of the account holder has not been well managed.Edit: what happens to the account after the person dies is not well managed.
So are you suggesting that posts are down because the people that were making them are dying off? I have my doubts about that one.
Facebook’s demographic isn’t skewed enough towards old people and it hasn’t existed for long enough for that to be a significant effect.
I mean, it isn’t as if octogenarians and septagenarians were making the bulk of Facebook posts 10 years ago, is it? The bulk of the people on Facebook are currently in the 18-44 range, and the 65+ group is actually a very small fraction. Source: https://www.statista.com/statistics/376128/facebook-global-user-age-distribution/
I would also like to remind you that Facebook started as a way to connect college kids in 2005. Those kids are now in their 30s or early 40s and very much still around. They’ve just given up on Facebook.
So I was one of those back in 06 and I’m in my mid to late 30s now.
I don’t use Facebook anymore and stopped using Facebook a decade ago because of all the timeline changes.
My guess is they’ve continued to make the timeline stuff worse and worse and that’s why people stop posting cause you don’t actually see each others posts half the time it’s filled with random suggested shit.
Where are the group chats happening then?
As far as I understand, Discord and WhatsApp, with maybe Slack still a thing in that space and maybe Zulip doing a decent job at eking out an open source alternative.
And from what I’ve seen, it’s a cool way to do online social media. I happened upon a Discord recently run by and for some people I was loosely in contact with online, and going in and saying hi and having and seeing some conversations, after being exclusively on the fedi for a while, opened my eyes to why it was such a thing … compared to the feed generating focus of reddit/twitter/facebook/youtube style big social platforms … it is truly SOCIAL media as it emphasises the creation of and interaction amongst an actual social group, not open ended public blog posting for the whole world to read and interact with. It also emphasises conversations, rather than “posts”.
From what I’ve gathered it is likely the phenomenon that is the Fediverse’s blindspot … the “new” form of social media that is growing in place of or supplementary to big social … that is making a better form of online social interaction without trying to “merely” modify the designs of big-social (where, let’s be real, even decentralisation is really a modification more focused on ownership than the form of social media).
The article talks about DMs on those platforms, but mainly focussed on Instagram
Nostr
Strongly agreed.
Some other loose thoughts related to this:
- a very similar phenomenon is visible in Bluesky, but in that case it skews heavily towards older millenials who are trying to recreate a culture that used to exist on Twitter, and is now dead. Bluesky is fundamentally even more backward looking than AP-fedi, as ATProto really cannot do much else than microblogging
- its been striking for me for a while that the fediverse developer community isnt able to become an actual community, and instead has been trying to reinvent community initiatives outside of fedi for a while, and they all bleed out. Think there are lots of reasons for that, but if the people building a social network cannot manage to use their own tools to use that social network to become a social community, than that usually does not bode well
- there is a very loosely defined ‘community’ of people who are interested in talking about fedi on a meta (not Meta) level. youve been involved, so you know most of the names. Again, its striking to me that this group (me included) hasnt really transformed into an actual community, and instead its fleeting ephemeral posts on a feed that only some of the regulars see and comment on.
I think you have a point. However, my 13-year-old and most of her school are all on Snapchat and use it constantly. They’re also regularly posting TikTok videos. Kids get in trouble for doing them at school all the time.
Interesting! You think TikTok and Snapchat are counters to my closed group chat observation?
If so I didn’t mean to suggest that that’s where everyone is going. Not at all. TikTok and Snapchat would be examples of the generational factor I was talking about.
No, I said you had a point. I was just addressing the idea that, while it may be generational, even the current generation is still addicted to social media. Maybe less so, but still addicted to it.
Right! All good!
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Welcome to modern “journalism”.
I signed up for Facebook for the first time ever, to comment on a local page about a local issue, and was first banned by Facebook for nothing in particular. Had to put in a phone number to reactivate. Also found I wasn’t able to post if I included a link, a link to a government website, but I guess that’s a very basic spam filter for new accounts. Then made some comments back and forth with no one really talking to me. Then about a week later with no activity, my account had been banned again, and now Facebook wants a photo. I don’t even have photos online, and I don’t see how they could use that to verify my identity, so that’s where I stopped.
It’s standard practice for Facebook and it’s been for several years now. It’s simultaneously a way to combat bots and a way to start collecting data about you in case you turn out to be a juicy real human. They want your pic and your contacts so they can start establishing your real identity and recognize you in pictures posted by others. If you don’t help them do that you’re worthless to them so they block you.
My mum was briefly banned on FB the other day and she’s the most inoffensive person on the planet. This is an account that’s maybe a decade old. They reinstated her account after she appealed so something seems broken with their banning system.
Wait, what the heck is BeReal? I’ve never heard of it before?
Does that mean I’m old now?
At the start of each school year some niche social media gains popularity, simply because each year wants something new and “untainted”. Last year BeReal benefitted from this. It likely won’t survive for long as they’re losing users now
It reminds me of SnapChat back in the day when every other social network started copying their features. TikTok has “TikTok Now” now which is what BeReal was.
Took you a while, but yes.
Even us old people should know that he’s the guy from Cypress Hill
I literally had the same reaction lol
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You have a great way with words
So, we need MySpace. A fedispace.
OurSpace
🐰
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-> Nostr
My time capsule of cringe will remain closed, thank you very much.
Don’t know if this is sarcasm, but I happen to agree to some extent.
I’m 100% serious. Friend based, no feed, group chat, “homepage” style profiles with tastefully-disgusting design. “Top 10” friends (I want that drama lol).
Is there an ActivityPub version of Facebook or Instagram?
Frendica and Pixelfed.
Pixelfed?
I am not suprised in the slightest. They are extremly pointless ,i simply do not really care that somone is on bahamas or whatewers. The only thing i even used facebook for were a specialized groups and Messenger. The only real social media i cared about was reddit and similars simply beacuse they encouraged discussion about stuff and provided anonimity ( and anonimity helps massiviely when your opinions arent exatcly popular ).
But now you care about Lemmy right? SAY IT! SAY IT!
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This is the best summary I could come up with:
Other apps like Dispo, Poparazzi, and Locket have all used various gimmicks to try and recapture social media’s halcyon days — each had a moment in the sun at the top of the US Apple app-store charts — but none have truly broken through.
For instance, the content creator Nina Haines launched a group called SapphLit, a self-described “sapphic book club born out of the queer BookTok community.”
Victoria Johnston, a 22-year-old software engineer, imagines the ideal social-media platform as a “safe space where people can just connect and you don’t feel pressured to have a big following or a presence or be really well known.”
And as more users and creator communities migrate toward closed spaces, the behemoths like Instagram are also trying to capitalize on this reality by introducing features like paid-subscription services that offer exclusive group chats.
Lia Haberman, an adjunct professor at UCLA Extension and an advisor for the American Influencer Council, said that Gen Alpha, the age cohort of 13 and younger, are “not embracing traditional social-media platforms and customs.”
It’s hard to know how the change will affect the online atmosphere over the long term — some evidence suggests the shift will create a healthier digital experience, but it also risks further dividing people into like-minded echo chambers.
The original article contains 2,197 words, the summary contains 214 words. Saved 90%. I’m a bot and I’m open source!
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You’re gonna…. Read the articles?!! 🤨
This was a very interesting read. Hard to predict how social media platforms will look in 10 years
I think the reason group chats are gaining is because we are so numbed by all the public platforms. Between doom scrolling and ads noone pays any attention to personal posts anymore.
For me personally I would even go one step further and say that I’m really annoyed by people force-feeding me their peronal life/experiences.
Now they start (ab)using group chats for it:
A group created for organizing rock climbing activities: All of a sudden filled with photos of this summers vacation. OK, we are friends and know each other, but still…
Another one was for a specific training of a mountaineering club, people who just met for this one occasion: Half a year later someone starts posting photos of their latest trip. And then the next, …
Maybe in my case it’s the generation that started sm (lol) with attention seeking extrovert posts that do not get any attention on fb/x anymore, so they go to group chats.
What might still be true for younger people is that with all the noise on the internet a group chat may be a place that gives you a manageable chunk of content with a private touch that makes perosonal involvement worthwile/doable again.
And now let’s watch it get abused&destroyed by corporations.
I still miss Google+, my friends and my sharing is based on the subject not my relation to my friends.
Fake, nobody misses Google+
I’m guessing that we are around 1% of the general population 😉
Not enough for a big company to build a community on though. Of course, it would have helped if Google hadn’t restricted sign-up. Just because it worked for Gmail, but a social network is a different beast than email, that already had a critical mass of users.
My Fantasy and SF book lovers goup on Facebook has more posts per day than I can read and gets new members every day. My music groups on Facebook have even more posts and content. Linkedin has more and more social posts (not a good thing, but hardly on the decline)
Article is clearly written by someone with no initiatve or personality or insight.
Anecdotal evidence, but in my group of friends, the only platform where people, me included, post regurlaly is bereal and I suppose it’s because it’s more like a group chat when you only watch what your friends post. We are older than teens though.
I don’t understand this thing because of its limited format. Like… You can’t even express yourself much like you would with text posts or regular video. You can just state “well here is what I have right here” Not to mention that from what I understand, it pretty much incentivizes you to post your FACE online which is a no-no.
No one’s posting on BeReal
No one’s even heard of BeReal. That could be part of the problem there.
