The comment threads here are weird. Who, in their right mind, would ever support a country like Russia? It’s mind blowing.
There sure are a lot of Lemmy bro-gaders and NATO shillbots in this thread. That’s the only explanation for people disagreeing with me.
doing my duty by brigading (commenting on the number 1 post on all)
IMO these critics are used to air superiority which Ukraine doesn’t have.
HexBear and brigading yet another Ukraine thread with misinformation and Kremlin propaganda, name a more iconic duo.
EDIT: It appears that I’ve triggered the horde.
It’s the second post on our /all/ page?
You’ve all got to get used to the way federation works. Because everyone is federated with different instances the /all/ page is different for different instances. This means that when a thread reaches /all/ on a specific instance you will get a lot of their users showing up at the same time. This is true of all the large instances, lemm.ee and lemmy.ml pour into our threads all at once when they reach the top of their feeds, but it’s different for every site so you get this outcome where a lot happens all at once.
So basically this is going to cause a world War of social media echo chambers
Echo chamber is when you encounter people that disagree with you
It’s pretty much exactly the opposite of echo chambers. Which is why these threads are usually full of shellshocked libs
Are the Hexbear users who are saying Ukraine is being ungrateful repeating Kremlin propaganda or are the Hexbear users who are saying Ukraine has a point repeating Kremlin propaganda?
Is Kremlin propaganda just ontologically what a Hexbear user says?
nice to know whatever I say is the kremlin position.
Congratulations on your promotion.
I’d like to thank me mum
But I dont see hexbears saying Ukraine is being ungratef… Oh. I see.
:P
I’m referring to the concerning number of users from your instance who seem obsessed with parroting what has been confirmed to be Kremlin propaganda and lies spread through deliberate misinformation campaigns. Obviously, this isn’t all HexBear users, but you guys clearly have a general problem with this kind of stuff.
parroting what has been confirmed to be Kremlin propaganda
Ah yes, Kremlin propaganda that is being spread around by… THE UKRAINIAN GOVERNMENT!
💀💀💀💀💀💀💀💀💀💀💀💀💀💀💀
Ukrainians are Russians so everything they say is Russian propaganda duh
What are some specific examples of “confirmed Kremlin propaganda” are being posted by Hexbear users in this thread?
They never respond with actual examples.
Edit: Lmao they’ve responded with a post that points out Ukraine has been killing people in the Donbas before the war started and a post that highlights the many offramps to the current conflict
Points out numerous examples, expecting actual good faith engagement.
“LOL! You’re wrong!”
This is why nobody likes you guys and wants to defederate with you. Really great job everyone.
This is why nobody likes you guys and wants to defederate with you.
Yeah, all those people who dislike us are upvoting you right now.
Lol! You’re wrong because…
I think you forgot half of the sentence.
Ceding land to a foreign aggressor is not a viable off-ramp. Get real.
Do you seriously have to ask?
This post wasn’t difficult to find.
Acting as if ending the war is Ukraine’s responsibility, rather than one of the country engaging in a literal invasion.
Anyone who doesn’t take the 2014 referendum with an extreme grain of salt is slotting nicely into Russia’s current playbook.
I seriously don’t understand why so many of you dickride Russia, other than “west bad”. The current Russian government is antithetical to so many of the values you claim to champion.
https://hexbear.net/comment/3865920
Here’s another for the road.
EDIT:
Numerous comments people claiming that the Maidan Revolution was actually a US backed coup, with zero evidence provided outside of Kremlin and state operated mouthpieces of course.
Possibly the most egregious yet: apparently the Bucha massacre was a hoax. Remember all those videos we saw of Russian soldiers gunning down unarmed civilians? Apparently they all must have been doctored, or were actually Ukrainian soldiers dressed up as Russian soldiers gunning down their own people.
One of my close friends is a Ukrainian photographer/videographer who was among the first on the scene after the Russians left Bucha. You’ve very likely seen some of his photos before. I can only imagine the rage he’d feel if he were to read some of the bullshit that these comments are attempting to spread.
Honestly, my opinion of HexBear has reached a new low after this thread. I used to be against defederation, but now I can at least understand why people don’t want to be associated at all with your instance.
EDIT 2: This post was locally removed on HexBear. I think that says enough on its own.
spoiler
I seriously don’t understand why so many of you dickride Russia
love how liberals manage to weave in casual homophobia whenever geopolitics comes up, you people make me sick
It’s not because of blind allegiance to Russia or anything like that, people have positions counter to your narrative as the result of actually paying attention to events, as they’ve unfolded, over years.
Impressive how mad you babies get when people don’t swallow the lies you’re peddling, expecting them to be taken as implicitly true or something.
Talk about swallowing lies after regurgitating Russian propaganda? You are all blinded yourself by your hate for the US that you are willing to deny massacres or genocides.
What Russian propaganda? I live in the US, I have more of a problem with my government than a government on the other side of the planet, no matter how scary the liberals try to make them sound.
I see this one a lot.
I seriously don’t understand why so many of you dickride Russia, other than “west bad”. The current Russian government is antithetical to so many of the values you claim to champion.
Seriously, who? Who is “dickriding Russia because west bad”? The current state of Russia is the result of the USSR’s undemocratic dissolution and the subsequent shock doctrine, obviously it’s antithetical to our values. Everyone knows that. People aren’t being blinded by “west bad” - because they generally aren’t literal children who can only understand the world in terms of good guys and bad guys. What they’re doing is critically analyzing media and history.
Hate to employ the dreaded whataboutism, but it seems to me this critique applies more to the opposite side. You say people are “Slotting nicely into Russia’s playbook”, “parroting Kremlin propaganda”. On their own, these are empty thought-terminators. You’re not concerned about understanding reality, just about making absolutely sure you’re 100% not on “Russia’s side” of this issue, because they’re the bad guys in this dichotomy.
I seriously don’t understand why so many of you dickride the west, other than “Russia bad”. The current western governments are antithetical to so many of the values you claim to champion.
You guys say that but I’ve never seen a hexbear criticizing Russia or their side of the story, only accept it as gospel. You say you don’t do that but then blindly accept their time line for the Bucha massacre or pretend their reasons for attacking a sovereign nation are real or ignore a bunch of irregularities in their 2014 referendum voting. Russia leaving is apparently never an option when they talk about possible solutions, only Ukraine giving up territory. You say the world isn’t only good guys and bad guys but because when the things you guys say are actually analyzed, it’s obvious that it’s a lie. The west is bad, everyone else is less bad. Therefore in any thread with Ukraine, because the west is on their side, they are the bad guys. Even though Russia also has a corruption problem and Nazi problem and has a history of invading their numbers for decades. But they have the bigger military, so I guess all their neighbors have to give up their best territory to Russia for free and their citizens shouldn’t expect to do anything about it and the the rest of the world has to let them.
Meanwhile, many of the people who criticize Russia in this attack don’t dickride the West at all and hate plenty of things about it and will say it in the same thread or tons of others. Like they should definitely decide whether they’ll fully support Ukraine or not, but we all know that to do that they’d have to get more support from their voters, which is often more difficult said than done, especially since Ukraine isn’t actually in NATO.
Russia leaving is apparently never an option when they talk about possible solutions
Yes… it isn’t. Thats how reality works. Russia isn’t going to just up and leave. They aren’t going to have thousands of their own people killed and then just… nothing. They have goals, they want to meet them, and if not then at least get somewhat of a victory. The people in Russia aren’t going to like “oh, we just left”. I don’t fucking understand how people can say “the war ends when russia [just up and leaves]”. This isn’t fantasy land, that isn’t how it works. Russia will leave, if Ukraine negotiates a peace with them. If Russia wants land then UK has to negotiate for that not to happen.
You claim that these are examples of “confirmed Kremlin propaganda”. What sources and/or authorities confirm the opinions contained in these posts as Kremlin propaganda?
Here’s one. It’s a business insider article disputing the Russian line on the Bucha massacre.
Neither of the posts linked to in the removed post talked about the Bucha massacre though.
So a post that highlights the many offramps to the current conflict, and describes how Ukraine can no longer “win” is Kremlin propaganda?
The other is a post that describes that Ukraine has killed civilians in the Donbass under Zelensky, do you dispute this?
Russia is going to strive for world-standard lgbt+ equality initiatives and to implement OGAS for once and for all
You Then: post something bad and untrue about Hexbear
You Now: Why are all these Hexbears commenting on my post?
Welcome to federation, enjoy your staywelcome to federation. we can tell you to fuck off and kill yourself too tankie.
Yet another liberal bot brigade spewing nato talking points
they got them poor langley interns down the postin mines workin overtime i tell ya hwaht
‘Brigading is when you federate and then use the federation feature. I am very smart.’
Libs and calling responding to a post that pops up on our feed “brigading”
Libs and calling claims with citations and references “propaganda”I’m a socialist, but go off king.
Aw, you think you’re not a liberal
So I’m not a true socialist unless I support Putin’s war of aggression. Got it.
you don’t really have to support Putin per se, many of us including myself would feel glee watching him be put up against a wall by communist revolutionaries, but supporting NATO is a pretty big dealbreaker given NATO’s imperialist and fascist history. e.g. Several Nazi German officials being put into NATO’s government. Gladio and funding of fascist stay-behind groups in the event of Soviet invasion. Yugoslavia. Libya. I certainly want NATO to be destroyed, hopefully from within rather than without to prevent nuclear war, and unfortunately for us, the reactionary state of Russia seems to be the best bet to maybe have that eventually occur.
also, stop calling things “wars of aggression” unless you’re going to call everything a war of aggression, my god. what an annoying thought-terminating cliche.
Absolutely nobody has said that except you.
Very typical lib talking point though. What socialist spaces do you get your news and information from? Any at all? Or do you just immerse yourself in liberal spaces then end up repeating everything they say and wonder why socialists all call you a liberal? Serious question btw. What socialist media and socialist spaces do you actually participate in and follow? How can you possibly consider yourself to have gotten rid of the liberal brainworms you’ve had your entire life if you continue to immerse yourself within the liberal superstructure?
I think you all made things pretty clear when you consider that the only thing I’ve actually done here is make it clear that I don’t support Russia in this war and am being blasted for being a “lib” for doing so.
You’re being delusional. I don’t owe you anything.
makes claims
claims refuted
I don’t owe you anything.
No investigation, no right to speak
Please respect other users pronouns even if you politically disagree with them
Thank you ♥️
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Just “but go off” would work perfectly well.
I simply wouldn’t use misgendering turns of phrase
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And not use misgendering language? We all make mistakes at times, it’s what happens, and it’s fair to ask questions to better understand, but being against it after you’ve been informed strikes me as silly
Then go ahead, we’re all waiting
There’s a lot of gendered turns of phrases, which doesn’t necessarily make them acceptable. I make a lot of mistakes myself it’s alright, it’s what happens.
it’s a turn of phrase.
Wait until you find out that “go off queen” is also a thing. I wonder why “go off king” and “go off queen” has to both exist. Could it be that this idiomatic expression is a gendered one and that using the expression on someone who doesn’t identify with that gender is a form of misgendering?
I haven’t seen either of these phrases, but in my experience even when something is supposed to be the equivalent versions of each other, it somehow feels different to hear and say. Like, it feels alright to call my group of friends “bros” but not “sisses.” Could it be that “go off queen” and “go off king” have different connotations despite the fact that they should mean the same thing?
The reason that one version of the “go off” phrase (identical in every way to the other except for one word that specifies gender) might feel to you like it has different connotations is because we live in a patriarchal society that doesn’t assign value the same across all genders. That’s not an excuse to use the version of that phrase which misgenders someone.
And your example is really weird and obscures what’s actually at issue. The difference in meaning between the words “bros” and “sissies” goes way beyond just a difference in gender. One is a common and generally affectionate term that men call each other when being friendly. The other is most often used as misogynistic term to insult men by disparaging their masculinity.
You might claim you are, but you’re acting like a
and actions are what determine what we areActing like a lib for pointing out an abundance of blatant misinformation? 🤔
You are a lib for disagreeing with me, the one true leftist.
we literally can’t see what you postedI sadly cannot see your externally hosted image. I am sure however that it was revisionism, so I choose to feel no sadness
- removed externally hosted image *
Owned
Socialism with State Department Talking Points Characteristics.
Couldn’t resist that misgendering urge huh?
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Again, all I said was I support Ukraine and call out deliberate disinformation. You guys seriously need to work on your reading comprehension.
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brigading is when people disagree with me on a site where people post news articles and everyone posts their opinion
rent free
you’re the one posting fuckface, kys
You’re the one who’s getting outposted dumbass. Rent free.
wtf is outposting you goddamn nerd
Easy way to trigger them:
Ahem…
“Human Rights”
You’re brigading too. So is OP ironically.
When we talk amongst ourselves we’re an echo chamber.
When we talk to other people we’re brigading.
During the cold war, the anticommunist ideological framework could transform any data about existing communist societies into hostile evidence. If the Soviets refused to negotiate a point, they were intransigent and belligerent; if they appeared willing to make concessions, this was but a skillful ploy to put us off our guard. By opposing arms limitations, they would have demonstrated their aggressive intent; but when in fact they supported most armament treaties, it was because they were mendacious and manipulative. If the churches in the USSR were empty, this demonstrated that religion was suppressed; but if the churches were full, this meant the people were rejecting the regime’s atheistic ideology. If the workers went on strike (as happened on infrequent occasions), this was evidence of their alienation from the collectivist system; if they didn’t go on strike, this was because they were intimidated and lacked freedom. A scarcity of consumer goods demonstrated the failure of the economic system; an improvement in consumer supplies meant only that the leaders were attempting to placate a restive population and so maintain a firmer hold over them. If communists in the United States played an important role struggling for the rights of workers, the poor, African-Americans, women, and others, this was only their guileful way of gathering support among disfranchised groups and gaining power for themselves. How one gained power by fighting for the rights of powerless groups was never explained. What we are dealing with is a nonfalsifiable orthodoxy, so assiduously marketed by the ruling interests that it affected people across the entire political spectrum.
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I’ve read this before; where is it from?
Blackshirts and Reds by Michael Parenti
Based Parenti. I’ve recently read him on Tibet and his writing style is striking.
That’s usually how echo chambers and brigading work, yes.
Not saying you are, don’t really care either way.
If you don’t care, then why make an obtuse comment that seems to not get the point that was being made?
So does that mean all discussion is one of the two?
It’s funny seeing the replies to your comment crying about “not brigading” but then the vast majority of the comments in this post come from hexbear users commenting tankie shit
Everybody who disagrees with me is a brigader
Could it be active users of this platform are organically posting in this thread???
No, i don’t agree with them, so they’re brigading
Are the brigades in the room with us right now?
Gentlemen, there is no brigading in the war room!
commenting tankie shit
remind me what the ml in this comm name refers to
Milquetoast libs
But more seriously, while the Lemmy devs are comrades, the .ml stands for Mali. That’s it.
These new emojis are just fantastic
‘Brigading is when you federate and then use the federation feature. I am very smart.’
It’s almost as if they completely lack self-awareness.
Lack of self awareness = when something is on our /all/ page ???
And why aren’t you responding to anything? So much for being a socialist, you have zero engagement with anything other than liberal beliefs and do absolutely nothing to defend your position or challenge yourself.
Lol, I’ve responded to plenty. Do you seriously expect me to respond to each of the 100+ comments that have been left by HexBear users? It’s not like any of you are capable of changing your mind about anything. Waste of time.
Yes? What do you think challenging yourself is?
Answer my points on your nationalist brainworms being completely at odds with any assessment of yourself as “socialist” at the very least.
Lol, chill TF out. I have much better things to do than spend hours arguing with weirdos on Lemmy.
And again, all I have done is said that I support Ukraine. I also happen to be a socialist. Why is that so hard for you to wrap your head around?
And again, all I have done is said that I support Ukraine. I also happen to be a socialist. Why is that so hard for you to wrap your head around?
Because you don’t support the people, you support the bourgeois state and your position boils down to “I am willing to kill hundreds of thousands of people to protect it.”
This is not socialist ideology. This is first and foremost nationalism, which variant of it I am as yet uncertain as you’ve said nothing about what your “socialism” entails. I am unable to assess whether you’re a nazi or a plain old liberal that pretends to be a socialist by saying you like welfare while still completely and totally supporting capitalism and liberal institutional design to maintain the bourgeoisie as the ruling class. The german gothic aesthetic you choose for your username certainly doesn’t help the suspicions I have over what you really are though, literally retvrn.
Lol, chill TF out. I have much better things to do than spend hours arguing with weirdos on Lemmy.
Then why have you spent hours arguing with weirdos on Lemmy?
Also you’ve done much more than that. You’ve slung out accusations of being Kremlin propagandists, among a lot of other stuff.
Why is that so hard for you to wrap your head around?
Because you were defending the US revolution to own more slaves and commit more genocide elsewhere in the thread, which isn’t a particularly socialist position.
- i don’t have time to engage in any actual points with people on Lemmy.
I only have time to bait an entire community so i can dissmiss them as weirdos for commenting on my bait post
I have much better things to do than spend hours arguing with weirdos on Lemmy.
Don’t lie, weirdo
It’s almost as if
bot detected, report sent
Brigading is when you engage with others
Interesting, I’m not seeing the hexbears… has my instance blocked them or has hexbear blocked me?
It’s kinda a nothing of value lost kinda situation, just curious about why I’m not seeing them any more.
Yea, they’re defederated from your instance. You can check it out in the instances list of each instance under “blocked”, here’s yours: https://lemmy.ca/instances
Ah cool, thanks!
So that means they see my posts but I don’t see theirs?
YepI think they don’t see yours either, but you can still go check out the cacophony in their hexden if morbidly curious: https://hexbear.net/post/475665?scrollToComments=falselol
On second thought, let’s not go to Hexbear, ‘tis a silly place
Well I might be moving instances…
The moron brigadie is getting old.
Daily reminder that we all see this pop up on our feed too and you’re going to have a higher quantity of people from other federated instances commenting by virtue of their being more of them active. No one is getting pings telling them it’s time to go to X thread and post Y take, that’s just a main character mindset people get into when they want to think they’re the underdog and the ‘other side’ isn’t playing fair.
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Thank you for your sacrifice, now we can just mass block them :)
Nice echo chamber you’ve got there
Apparently the thread’s got 117 comments, but only yours is showing. Don’t they have anything better to do? Seriously…
Apparently no 🤷
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Cold weather begins to hit in October. It’s not just “slow”, it’s over.
It’s like every time there’s a war everybody forgets how fucking long they take. WW2 took six years. The Vietnam War took almost 20 years, same with the Afghanistan War. Anybody expecting anything solid within the next couple years is delusional. Ukraine is in it for the long haul.
You know what? I never thought I’d say this but I’m with Ukraine on this one.
This whole counter offensive insanity is so militarily nonsensical that it had to have been mounted to please the West with a “win” so that they’d stay in the war. Real Chiang Kai Shek committing the best of the KMT army to Shanghai to impress the Westerners energy.
The West is standing on the sidelines, supplying just enough equipment to keep the embers going and judging the ordinary Ukrainians going to their deaths by their hundreds.
Fuck the clowns in charge in Kiev and fuck the Nazi militias obviously. But at this point the men being sent to the front are old men and boys dragged off the street against their will. Sending them to die to appease the West is fucking sick.
Pretty telling that the new line being fed to NATO worshippers is ‘don’t say anything critical about our objective failures’. This is, ironically, the same message Goebbels pushed when failures began to mount on the eastern front after Stalingrad and then Kursk. As the Soviet steamroller continued to Berlin, the line in the media was ‘it is unpatriotic to say we are losing’. And then they lost.
Did I read the same article as everyone else? I don’t get where “failed offensive” is coming from. It was western media that created the impression of an impending counter-offensive that would all but end the war, not anything from Ukraine’s armed forces as far as I know.
Since launching a much-vaunted counteroffensive using many billions of dollars of Western military equipment, Ukraine has recaptured more than a dozen villages but has yet to penetrate Russia’s main defences," … NATO Secretary-General Jens Stoltenberg told CNN that Ukrainian commanders deserved the benefit of the doubt. 'Ukrainians have exceeded expectations again and again," he said. “We need to trust them. We advise, we help, we support. But… it is the Ukrainians that have to make those decisions.”
This doesn’t sound like a “failed” offensive to me. The “much-vaunted” part came from the West, not Ukraine. It sounds to me like western officials got themselves psyched up based on nothing and are now whining about it. So like, yeah, critics of the slow counteroffensive, shut up. You sound as ridiculous as the people who acted like Kyiv would be taken by March 2022.
Everyone point & laugh at the sad tankie in this thread.
“The Ghost of Kyiv is still training with the F-35 you sent us,” President Zelenskyy told a Pentagon advisor who criticized the counter-offensive. “This is your people’s job. Either shut up, or provide better instructors.”
Wow. Zelensky isn’t playing. He means business
No shit. Western training and equipment is not fit for purpose. Acting as a colonial cop by bombing with impunity ≠ attacking the strongest defensive lines of the 21st century. All their wunderwaffe just gets blown up by mines or drones.
Cannot wait to see how well this comment ages. All the Hexabear stuff is just comedy gold in the long run. Thank you for spending your life force creating it.
The people telling you Ukraine is winning are lying to you. They don’t believe it. Ukraine doesn’t have enough equipment or enough soldiers.
The Wests only hope is a Russian coup. They’ll force every Ukrainian they can to die to try and make this happen. You cheer this death march on from the sidelines.
If you actually give a shit, go fight for Ukraine. If you don’t have the courage to die with them, then you have no right to advocate for continuing this war.
Yeah, Ukraine is really going to retake those two oblasts and Crimea. It will all be worth all the hundreds of thousands of lives thrown into the meatgrinder instead of honoring two ceasefires or negotiating a new ceasefire when that happens.
Real Hitler in his bunker energy, except instead of Hitler youre a nazi in some other country not directly involved coping about how Germany can still win.
Russia will never stop
But I’ve been told the Russian army is out of missiles and teetering on the brink of collapse again, now you’re saying they’re simultaneously a force capable of posing a realistic threat of invasion to…uh, the entire rest of the planet, apparently?
Are they like… Weak, and umm… Strong…? At the same time? I guess…?
Wait I think I heard this before.
You should volunteer if you think it’s this important to fight Russia
go fight them then.
They did stop. How do you think defensive lines are dug?
Terminal Marvelbrain
They’ve literally constantly offered offramps toward de-escalation. Two negotiated ceasefires were broken by ukrainian state backed militias in donbass before the war started.
Zelenksy tried to surrender. Boris Johnson derailed those talks to keep the war going.
Will you ever stop?
Cannot wait to see how well this comment ages. All the Hexabear stuff is just comedy gold in the long run. Thank you for spending your life force creating it.
Can’t imagine thinking commentary, wrong or right, about brutal trench warfare, could be comedy gold.
Thousands of dead for no good reason is “comedy gold”?
the emoji picker just got ten feet longer
How is the ghost of Kiev doing
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Embarrassing
Lmao 4 months in and this comment already didn’t age very well, with even outlets like NYT starting to report the truth about Ukraine’s offensives going terribly.
Also, I wouldn’t call thousands of people dying for meaningless western imperialism/NATO expansion “comedy gold”
Thus the highest form of generalship is to balk the enemy’s plans; the next best is to prevent the junction of the enemy’s forces; the next in order is to attack the enemy’s army in the field; and the worst policy of all is to besiege walled cities.
Good for Kyiv. Those armchair generals should shut up and fight if they think things are going slowly.
